Hi

I'm still very new to mame and I'm a little confused!

I haven't been able to find the answers to this, so can anyone here help?

Q1) General questions about dats

A) How come some dat files are named after a mame release (Mame32QA_Icons_v.119.zip), yet other are just names in dateformat eg

MAME Flyers 20070913
MAME Control Panels 20070913


B) For the date named ones, how do you know which mame release they are for (does it matter?)

For the Cabinets, Icons, Snaps, Flyers, artwork, control panels, marquees and tites, I guess mame32 will load the images if they are there, using filename. If your versions are out of date - then you'll have additional graphics which will not get displayed - as you don't have the game. (Are games ever removed from mame releases?)

However, the sample must to related to a mame release? So how do you know that "MAME Samples 20070916 (cm).zip" is suitable for Mame 119 (other than Romans download page from telling you?)


Q2) ClrMamePro, sample DAT files and Mame32
The "standard" MAME dat file (eg MAME v0.119.dat), when loaded in ClrMamePro, allows to to check against Roms, Samples and CHDS.

Why is there are separate samples dat file (MAME Samples 20070916 (cm).dat)?


Also, I've got the "Green light" when verifying with "MAME Samples 20070916 (cm).dat", but when I check samples with the standard mame dat, I'm asked if I want to delete non-needed files, eg

Mame32b\samples\ballbomb\1.wav'

Then with Mame32, if I "Audit All Roms" - I'm told I have 170 correct sample, 1 incorrect out of a total of 171. (In the summary window, I can't seem to see which one is incoorect).



Q3) ClrMamePro in general

Am I using ClrMamePro correctly?

This is what I (think) I want :-
"Merged Sets" for the ROMS
"Split Sets" for samples
"Split Sets" for CHDs

If I scan using just ROMS using Merged sets - I'm getting nothing missing (other than the nodumps)
As soon as I select scan sets and roms, I get a load of warnings about :-

wrong merged sample set
unneeded fake clone

Likewise, if I scan the CHDS using split sets, everything is ok.


I'm guess I'm still confused about what exactly a set is!?!

Thanks

> A) How come some dat files are named after a mame release
> (Mame32QA_Icons_v.119.zip), yet other are just names in dateformat

Datfile author decides.

> B) For the date named ones, how do you know which mame release they are for
> (does it matter?)

On my datfile page you find current ones which are suitable for the latest official MAME version.


> that "MAME Samples 20070916 (cm).zip" is suitable for Mame 119 (other than
> Romans download page from telling you?)

The latest samples datfile on my page is MAME Samples 20071017 (cm) and it's suitable for MAME .120.



> Why is there are separate samples dat file (MAME Samples 20070916 (cm).dat)?

Because MAME's direct import lists samples only by name. No size, hashvalues etc. are available.


> Also, I've got the "Green light" when verifying with "MAME Samples 20070916

You got an outdated samplesdatfile.


> Then with Mame32, if I "Audit All Roms" - I'm told

MAME32's audit functionality is broken since ages.



> Q3) ClrMamePro in general
> This is what I (think) I want :-
> "Merged Sets" for the ROMS
> "Split Sets" for samples
> "Split Sets" for CHDs

You can only have ONE merge mode which is valid for sets. And sets consits of roms and/or samples and/or chds.



> I'm guess I'm still confused about what exactly a set is!?!

A set is everything which is defined in the xml/datfile game tags. A set can be a collection of roms and/or samples and/or chds. There are e.g. chd-only sets.



Roman Scherzer

Thanks for the info.

I've now rebuilt using splits sets.

q1) However, I've still got an issue with the samples.

You said,
"The latest samples datfile on my page is MAME Samples 20071017 (cm) and it's suitable for MAME .120."

But, I'm wanting to get my version .119 fully "sorted".
(It's taken the best part of 5 nights to get everything downloaded, and I'm still missing some artwork.)

I downloaded the "MAME Samples 20070916 (cm).zip" from your dats page as that was flagged as suitable with Mame 119.
(This goes back to an earlier question, how do you know that "MAME Samples 20071017 (cm)" is for .120?)

Anyway - using "MAME Samples 20070916 (cm).dat" gets the green light. (All the "Fix" boxes are checked).

When using Mame v0.119 and scanning sets, roms, samples and chds (using split sets), I get a few unneeded files reported in the samples :-

Eg

Balloon Bomber [folder: ballbomb - sampleparent: invaders - size: 12kb]
unneeded file: D:\Emumlators\mame 119\119\Mame32b\samples\ballbomb\1.wav
unneeded file: D:\Emumlators\mame 119\119\Mame32b\samples\ballbomb\2.wav
unneeded file: D:\Emumlators\mame 119\119\Mame32b\samples\ballbomb\3.wav
unneeded file: D:\Emumlators\mame 119\119\Mame32b\samples\ballbomb\4.wav
unneeded file: D:\Emumlators\mame 119\119\Mame32b\samples\ballbomb\5.wav
unneeded file: D:\Emumlators\mame 119\119\Mame32b\samples\ballbomb\6.wav
unneeded file: D:\Emumlators\mame 119\119\Mame32b\samples\ballbomb\7.wav
unneeded file: D:\Emumlators\mame 119\119\Mame32b\samples\ballbomb\8.wav
unneeded file: D:\Emumlators\mame 119\119\Mame32b\samples\ballbomb\9.wav

Which dat file should you trust?

q2) This date format naming convention.
Assuming you had the "Mame Roll back roms", you could revert to any previous mame release.
Historical artwork, samples etc dat files are also kept on other sites.

If you wanted to go back to Mame release X - how do you know which auxiliary dats to use?

Or to put ot another way, anyone know which samples work with 112?



Thanks

q1) The way how invaders sample clones are handled has been changed. You can't compare a .119 datfile scan with a .119 mame import scan when you've updated to cmpro 3.106c. Background: MAME exports several invaders sample clones while invaders doesn't use samples anymore. Earlier cmpro versions corrected them to use their own sampleset, latest allows not-existing sampleof parents.

> q2) If you wanted to go back to Mame release X - how do you know which auxiliary
> dats to use?

Old MAME versions are obsolete. There is no need to use anything besides the most current MAME.



Roman Scherzer

Hi again

Sorry for being a pain - but

"q1) The way how invaders sample clones are handled has been changed. You can't compare a .119 datfile scan with a .119 mame import scan when you've updated to cmpro 3.106c. Background: MAME exports several invaders sample clones while invaders doesn't use samples anymore. Earlier cmpro versions corrected them to use their own sampleset, latest allows not-existing sampleof parents."

sorry, but totally lost me!

Bottom line, from a new user point of view, should I :-
a) use the separate sample dat file, (and turn off the sample check when using "MAME v0.119.dat")
b) just use the "MAME v0.119.dat"and check sets, roms, samples & chds?

Thanks


"Old MAME versions are obsolete. There is no need to use anything besides the most current MAME."

I don't want to get flamed here, but, people must want to "goback" otherwise why the "Rollback roms" and historical mame dat files exist?


I may want to "go back" myself from 119 to 112. I saw a mate of a mates system, using an ArcadeVGA connected to a TV via RGB scart - and that was brilliant! That mate of a mate was running mame 106, and was happy with it - "more games than he could possibly ever play". I've got my ArcadeVGA card on order, but that mate said not to use "a version greater than 112, since some code had altred to do with samples and that you had to turn auto frame skipping on - which sort of defaeated the point."

My card hasn't arrived yet, and I don't know if he's right. But I may want to go back if he is.


My point is, and maybe I'm the only one missing something here, is that these various auxiliary dat files are linked to a version of a mame release. Why can't "joe public" easily know which marries with which? I'm curious!

Thanks

a) Samples. MAME's -listxml output lists samples without any hash or size information. That's the basic reason why there is an external datfile which does list these info. MAME's -listxml output lists several clones as 'sampleof invaders' while invaders itself doesn't use any samples anymore. So this entry is wrong and cmpro (before 3.106a) fixed this by removing the sampleof relationship. THat's why you need several invaders sampleset clonesets. This behaviour has changed since 3.106a and now you only need the invaders sampleset.
To sum it up: If you use cmpro 3.106c and the latest sample datfile you won't see any difference (dat vs exe) when scanning.

b) Again, there is no need to use a not up2date MAME version. If you need old datfiles you have to search them yourself. I personally never understand people to collect rollback files. There is no use to collect wrong sized and bad dumps. The datfile names are chosen by the author what suits best.

So it's rather easy to answer what to use: The latest official MAME and the latest artwork (flyers/samples/etc) dats for that version.


Roman Scherzer

Hi

Thanks for all your help on this - as I think I understand now.

(I've compared my sample dat file with "the latest" and can see what's gone).