I played that Metroid game. You use the bottom touch screen to aim and the top screen is the action. It was pretty damn cool. I'm definitely putting this at the top of my Xmas list.

TOO BAD THERE IS NO SINGLE PLAYER IN THE METROID GAME.

WTF.

FUCK THAT.

I'll wait until the new Super Mario Bros. comes out.

> TOO BAD THERE IS NO SINGLE PLAYER IN THE METROID GAME.
>
> WTF.
>
> FUCK THAT.
>
> I'll wait until the new Super Mario Bros. comes out.
>
Uhh wrong? I've had a few minutes on it already and the mini freebie game that comes with the unit is actually a set of 3 minigames that are timed at 10min. The top one of the 3 at the least is a 1P only game, and that's the one I tested out stylus aiming in it and found it quite handy.

Final game out early next year has a full 1p campaign game behind it and the mp aspect too so everyone can enjoy it. Given the great control it won't end up sucking like the cube games where lack of control gets you guaranteed cheapshots while trying to lockon.

But it does play quite a bit better than Prime.

Walmart broke the street date on those babies and some friends brought theirs into work last night.

I pre-purchased mine, Mario and Ridge Racer at Lamestop. *ONLY* did this because (well pre-purchase part as I'm short on cash) but the real reason is they have a 1yr warranty for $20. The warranty covers anything including abuse, but not as far as theft. They give you a new one at that point and you just pay another $20 for another year.

Considering it's new tech, the stylus and screen, and the rest I wanted to play it safe. Fucking hate that store otherwise, they're assholes to people, overcharge on games, and stiff you the worst on trade-in credits.

> Uhh wrong?

Well, I only read what IGN had to say about it, and when I heard it was multiplayer only, I stopped reading about it. I thought they had the final word if they would report that. Then again, it's IGN.

Metroid Prime: Hunters is, essentially, a handheld version of the multiplayer mode that Metroid Prime 2 will feature. Link. I was pissed off enough about there being multiplayer in Metroid Prime 2, that it would take development resources away from the single player. I thought it was even more of a waste because it seemed that Metroid Prime was meant to be single player, how could multiplayer be fun to those demanding it simply because Metroid Prime could be classified as an FPS? Heresy! HERESY!!!!

They had also reported that Super Mario DS would also include the single player game Super Mario 64 more recently, but originally reported that it would be multiplayer only. So I guess it doesn't surprise me in the end that they got it wrong with MP:H as well.

> I've had a few minutes on it already and the mini freebie game that
> comes with the unit is actually a set of 3 minigames that are timed at 10min.
> The top one of the 3 at the least is a 1P only game, and that's the one I tested
> out stylus aiming in it and found it quite handy.

Minigames don't really qualify as single player imho... unless it's Wario Ware!

> Final game out early next year has a full 1p campaign game behind it and the mp
> aspect too so everyone can enjoy it.

Well you've just changed my view on the whole subject now! I would only be buying the game for its single player. Multiplayer is boring to me unless it's a fighting game, but even then, I'd even rather play Super Smash Bros Melee single player, so you see why the idea of multiplayer only really put me off. I really liked the concept of Metroid Prime: Hunters originally.

> Given the great control it won't end up
> sucking like the cube games where lack of control gets you guaranteed cheapshots
> while trying to lockon.

Well, I have no problem with the Cube game anyway (the controls felt natural), and I'm sure the DS would be the same. In fact, it must be just like using a mouse/keyboard on PC.

Except how do you hold the D-Pad and still be able to lay the system flat so you can use the stylus on the screen?

Hmm, speaking of using a stylus on the screen, I hope they make the lens out of the same material as this. Pity if it would get scratched up! I'm sure Nintendo accounted for that, though.

> Uhh wrong?

Well, I only read what IGN had to say about it, and when I heard it was multiplayer only, I stopped reading about it. I thought they had the final word if they would report that. Then again, it's IGN.

Metroid Prime: Hunters is, essentially, a handheld version of the multiplayer mode that Metroid Prime 2 will feature. Link. I was pissed off enough about there being multiplayer in Metroid Prime 2, that it would take development resources away from the single player. I thought it was even more of a waste because it seemed that Metroid Prime was meant to be single player, how could multiplayer be fun to those demanding it simply because Metroid Prime could be classified as an FPS? Heresy! HERESY!!!!

They had also reported that Super Mario DS would also include the single player game Super Mario 64 more recently, but originally reported that it would be multiplayer only. So I guess it doesn't surprise me in the end that they got it wrong with MP:H as well.

> I've had a few minutes on it already and the mini freebie game that
> comes with the unit is actually a set of 3 minigames that are timed at 10min.
> The top one of the 3 at the least is a 1P only game, and that's the one I tested
> out stylus aiming in it and found it quite handy.

Minigames don't really qualify as single player imho... unless it's Wario Ware!

> Final game out early next year has a full 1p campaign game behind it and the mp
> aspect too so everyone can enjoy it.

Well you've just changed my view on the whole subject now! I would only be buying the game for its single player. Multiplayer is boring to me unless it's a fighting game, but even then, I'd even rather play Super Smash Bros Melee single player, so you see why the idea of multiplayer only really put me off. I really liked the concept of Metroid Prime: Hunters originally.

> Given the great control it won't end up
> sucking like the cube games where lack of control gets you guaranteed cheapshots
> while trying to lockon.

Well, I have no problem with the Cube game anyway (the controls felt natural), and I'm sure the DS would be the same. In fact, it must be just like using a mouse/keyboard on PC.

Except how do you hold the D-Pad and still be able to lay the system flat so you can use the stylus on the screen?

Hmm, speaking of using a stylus on the screen, I hope they make the lens out of the same material as this. Pity if it would get scratched up! I'm sure Nintendo accounted for that, though.

Haw double post there halc... Anyways. One thing I learned back in 1999 about IGN is that they're the worst source for news they can slant, and even worse than that when it comes to reviews. Learned seeing some of their blasphamous Dreamcast game reviews they take 5min and just pull stories out of their asses.

Good rule to keep in mind with IGN.

IGN is the first 3 letters in IGNorant, because they are.

The truth of the story is MPH is a 1p and MP game equally. Not a pisspoor 1P with controllable ghosts like Zelda on cube. And it's not a game with just a MP mode with like 1map and limited shit. Both have much to appreciate.

I remember the Mario comments by those morons at IGN. Reality is really that Mario64 is NOT mario64, it's like Mario64-2 with added worlds, added players, fully different story, all new moves, new powerups. Then you get a lot of minigames to unlock which can be done alone or with friends, and also in MP mode there's a combat fight for up to 4 people to take shots at each other in combat to steal stars (points) to come out on top with.

> Minigames don't really qualify as single player imho... unless it's Wario Ware!
>
I suppose so, but what the hey...first time a free game has been added with a system at launch since the SNES. So it's nice either way even if it is short.

> Well you've just changed my view on the whole subject now! I would only be
> buying the game for its single player. Multiplayer is boring to me unless it's
> a fighting game, but even then, I'd even rather play Super Smash Bros Melee
> single player, so you see why the idea of multiplayer only really put me off. I
> really liked the concept of Metroid Prime: Hunters originally.
>
You and me too. I couldn't get a real story on Metroid so it was off my list thinking that MP would be the emphasis, but knowing it's got a 1P game, and now that I've had a shot at it I want it too.

> Well, I have no problem with the Cube game anyway (the controls felt natural),
> and I'm sure the DS would be the same. In fact, it must be just like using a
> mouse/keyboard on PC.
>
Yah actually it's very very much like mouselook. Very rapid spin around response to blow some bastard to bits.

> Except how do you hold the D-Pad and still be able to lay the system flat so you
> can use the stylus on the screen?
>
Well one comfy method is to hold the left side like normal, then hold the stylus in your thumb, pointer and next finger...then wrap the other over R and the pinky under it as a great stablizer.

> Hmm, speaking of using a stylus on the screen, I hope they make the lens out of
> the same material as this. Pity if it would get scratched up! I'm sure
> Nintendo accounted for that, though.
>
All I know is they treated the screen with some special compound to make it very scratch resistant. I did hear in the last month a new compound has been being used recently in Japan that makes surfaces like that basically impervious to scratching short of taking sandpaper to it or etching it with a pointy object. It's going to be used for touch screens, mobile phone screens, CDs, DVDs, etc to preserve them better.

Ridge Racer DS doesn't interest me AT ALL. The stylus-controlled stearing wheel just does not jive with me at all, and the graphics are complete poo compared to the PSP version (which looks like racing sex)

The only thing preventing me from buying the PSP version is that I really don't like the post-Rage Racer Ridge Racer series. Especially Ridge Racers IV and V. Fuck those games. :(

> > Uhh wrong?
>
> Well, I only read what IGN had to say about it, and when I heard it was
> multiplayer only, I stopped reading about it. I thought they had the final word
> if they would report that. Then again, it's IGN.
>
> Metroid Prime: Hunters is, essentially, a handheld version of the multiplayer
> mode that Metroid Prime 2 will feature. Link. I was pissed off enough about
> there being multiplayer in Metroid Prime 2, that it would take development
> resources away from the single player. I thought it was even more of a waste
> because it seemed that Metroid Prime was meant to be single player, how could
> multiplayer be fun to those demanding it simply because Metroid Prime could be
> classified as an FPS? Heresy! HERESY!!!!
>
> They had also reported that Super Mario DS would also include the single player
> game Super Mario 64 more recently, but originally reported that it would be
> multiplayer only. So I guess it doesn't surprise me in the end that they got it
> wrong with MP:H as well.
>
> > I've had a few minutes on it already and the mini freebie game that
> > comes with the unit is actually a set of 3 minigames that are timed at 10min.
> > The top one of the 3 at the least is a 1P only game, and that's the one I
> tested
> > out stylus aiming in it and found it quite handy.
>
> Minigames don't really qualify as single player imho... unless it's Wario Ware!
>
> > Final game out early next year has a full 1p campaign game behind it and the
> mp
> > aspect too so everyone can enjoy it.
>
> Well you've just changed my view on the whole subject now! I would only be
> buying the game for its single player. Multiplayer is boring to me unless it's
> a fighting game, but even then, I'd even rather play Super Smash Bros Melee
> single player, so you see why the idea of multiplayer only really put me off. I
> really liked the concept of Metroid Prime: Hunters originally.
>
> > Given the great control it won't end up
> > sucking like the cube games where lack of control gets you guaranteed
> cheapshots
> > while trying to lockon.
>
> Well, I have no problem with the Cube game anyway (the controls felt natural),
> and I'm sure the DS would be the same. In fact, it must be just like using a
> mouse/keyboard on PC.
>
> Except how do you hold the D-Pad and still be able to lay the system flat so you
> can use the stylus on the screen?
>
> Hmm, speaking of using a stylus on the screen, I hope they make the lens out of
> the same material as this. Pity if it would get scratched up! I'm sure
> Nintendo accounted for that, though.
>

> Ridge Racer DS doesn't interest me AT ALL. The stylus-controlled stearing wheel
> just does not jive with me at all, and the graphics are complete poo compared to
> the PSP version (which looks like racing sex)

You can't control it with the d-pad?

> The only thing preventing me from buying the PSP version is that I really don't
> like the post-Rage Racer Ridge Racer series. Especially Ridge Racers IV and V.
> Fuck those games. :(

What's wrong with Ridge Racer V?

> Haw double post there halc... Anyways. One thing I learned back in 1999 about
> IGN is that they're the worst source for news they can slant, and even worse
> than that when it comes to reviews.

Yeah I've been burned by them. They suck. They review so many games (while posting news everywhere), who the fuck is playing them all? I'm sure they don't waste their time being paid to play if they can just pump up articles and make $$$.

I still look to them for news, just not reviews. Unfortunately since they have $$$ they also get exclusives (although some of the time those exclusives I've read on other sites previously) and interviews.

> The truth of the story is MPH is a 1p and MP game equally. Not a pisspoor 1P
> with controllable ghosts like Zelda on cube. And it's not a game with just
> a MP mode with like 1map and limited shit. Both have much to appreciate.

Hm.

> I remember the Mario comments by those morons at IGN. Reality is really that
> Mario64 is NOT mario64, it's like Mario64-2 with added worlds, added players,
> fully different story, all new moves, new powerups.

Well! Now I'm interested in that too! Ok, screw reading news updates on IGN... I really thought they were only unreputable for reviews, and the sheer hype they lay on everything.

> Then you get a lot of minigames to unlock which can be done alone or with
> friends, and also in MP mode there's a combat fight for up to 4 people to
> take shots at each other in combat to steal stars (points) to come out on
> top with.

That's interesting, but I really don't forsee anyone I know buying a DS (nobody I know owns anything portable), another problem with multiplayer, unless I meet a whole lot of DS players or there's long range wireless. Or something.

> > Minigames don't really qualify as single player imho... unless it's Wario
> Ware!
> >
> I suppose so, but what the hey...first time a free game has been added with a
> system at launch since the SNES. So it's nice either way even if it is short.

I was under the impression what came with the DS was just a demo, and the full MP:H would be released later? Oh well, if it's free, but short, I'll still be happy. I suppose they'll just release a sequel.

> Well one comfy method is to hold the left side like normal, then hold the
> stylus in your thumb, pointer and next finger...then wrap the other over R
> and the pinky under it as a great stablizer.

Is the system that light. Do you have to use R?

> All I know is they treated the screen with some special compound to make it
> very scratch resistant. I did hear in the last month a new compound has
> been being used recently in Japan that makes surfaces like that basically
> impervious to scratching short of taking sandpaper to it or etching it with
> a pointy object.

That's pretty cool!

> It's going to be used for touch screens, mobile phone screens, CDs, DVDs, etc
> to preserve them better.

Oh that's the same scratch resistant stuff I was hoping Nintendo would use. I wonder if they had any idea this would be available when they were thinking of making the DS? Either way, that's great! Thanks for all the info

I pre-ordered one, but it hasn't shipped yet. I'm more interested in the wireless stuff on it.

> > Ridge Racer DS doesn't interest me AT ALL. The stylus-controlled stearing
> wheel
> > just does not jive with me at all, and the graphics are complete poo compared
> to
> > the PSP version (which looks like racing sex)
>
> You can't control it with the d-pad?
>

HE'S WRONG. You can use the D-pad or the analog. And the analog using the thumbpad on the strap makes it a shitload easier than the lil stylus I'm sure.

> > The only thing preventing me from buying the PSP version is that I really
> don't
> > like the post-Rage Racer Ridge Racer series. Especially Ridge Racers IV and V.
> > Fuck those games. :(
>
> What's wrong with Ridge Racer V?
>
RR4 and 5 weren't bad, and who fucking cares how much eyecandy is there...it's GAMEPLAY that matters always. I wish people would understand that so so many subpar pos's don't get sold just due to eyecandy.

> That's interesting, but I really don't forsee anyone I know buying a DS (nobody
> I know owns anything portable), another problem with multiplayer, unless I meet
> a whole lot of DS players or there's long range wireless. Or something.
>
Well I know the 'warppipe' people that get non-online Cube games online are working on something to go through the net using the WiFi.

> I was under the impression what came with the DS was just a demo, and the full
> MP:H would be released later? Oh well, if it's free, but short, I'll still be
> happy. I suppose they'll just release a sequel.
>
It is a demo and not. Basically it's a demo/prequel according to them. The 1st of the 3 modes in it is a pre-story to the full game. You go through some stages and then take on a boss of sorts. When you get to the 'full' Metroid game it takes up from there.

> Is the system that light. Do you have to use R?
>
It's pretty light, nothing unweildly at all. And no, R will also fire the gun I'm told (didn't use it though myself.)

You're welcome for the info.

ALSO... if you want to see some reviews.

http://ds.advancedmn.com/ (DS itself and asphault gt)
http://www.nintendojo.com/ (MarioDS, asphault, madden, feel the magic, and the sims urbz)

I'd expect much at these quickly too:
http://www.ndscene.com/
http://www.planetgamecube.com/

I'm really upside down about everything!

Ridge Racer on the DS looks pretty cool, I always wanted a portable Ridge Racer. A lot of the game is just trying to get a better time, and I found myself playing F-Zero Maximum Velocity a lot for that reason.

> HE'S WRONG. You can use the D-pad or the analog. And the analog using the
> thumbpad on the strap makes it a shitload easier than the lil stylus I'm sure.
>

dpads for racing games went out years ago. the analog solution presented with the DS is piss poor imo.

> RR4 and 5 weren't bad, and who fucking cares how much eyecandy is there...it's
> GAMEPLAY that matters always. I wish people would understand that so so many
> subpar pos's don't get sold just due to eyecandy.

The gameplay of RR4 was terrible and RR5 was so cluttered with jaggies (resolution was too god damn low for the quality of the textures and all of the effects going on; made the game a visual mess) that it made the game too unplayable. Plus it was buggy.

The only game I've seen so far that really takes advantage of the touchpad in a viable way is Wario Ware, and I believe I've stated in the past that I'm picking up the system just for that game.

I fucking love Wario Ware.

> > HE'S WRONG. You can use the D-pad or the analog. And the analog using the
> > thumbpad on the strap makes it a shitload easier than the lil stylus I'm sure.
> >
>
> dpads for racing games went out years ago. the analog solution presented with
> the DS is piss poor imo.

I dunno, I still use a D-pad in racing games, the only times I really used analog were for Wipeout Fusion (50% of the time), F-Zero GX, and Burnout 3. It's easier to go from a quick right to a quick left with a D-Pad, and it's essential for drifting in a lot of games. It's faster to move from extreme right to extreme left with the D-pad (feels awkward on the PS2 to do that with the analog stick because of how my thumb is positioned), and I'm used to tapping the D-pad to get the steering I want for some reason. Probably because of twitchy games like Contra where you need to aim in a billion directions at once.

> The gameplay of RR4 was terrible and RR5 was so cluttered with jaggies
> (resolution was too god damn low for the quality of the textures and all of the
> effects going on; made the game a visual mess) that it made the game too
> unplayable. Plus it was buggy.

What're the bugs? I played the game pretty frequently and didn't notice them. The jaggies were OK, I could stand them. The fact that all new consoles used 480i instead of 240p (or whatever you want to call it) was annoying enough for my eyes so I learned to deal with that.

I agree the gameplay of RR4 wasn't so great. I went back and played it recently though and it held up a lot better than I remember, but when it came out I was very disappointed though. I don't know if I'd play it except just a spin to remember wtf it's like when I'm bored.

> The only game I've seen so far that really takes advantage of the touchpad in a
> viable way is Wario Ware, and I believe I've stated in the past that I'm picking
> up the system just for that game.

Feel the Magic looks hilarious, and I HATE dating sims. Oh yeah, this is CA, start the "rub the clit" jokes.

> I dunno, I still use a D-pad in racing games, the only times I really used
> analog were for Wipeout Fusion (50% of the time), F-Zero GX, and Burnout 3.

Analog works best for racing games because it's the only non-steeringwheel solution that reasonably emulates the percision offered. Moving from a dpad to a stick for racing is similar to the move from a keyboard to a keyboard and mouse for a first person shooter. At first the added level of control is a bit difficult to grasp, but after some time you'll wonder how you were ever able to race well without it.

Games that were never designed in the first place for analog sticks (shooters) suffer when you try to play them with anything other than a dpad or a solid arcade stick, though. There it's all about the mad twitch action. I'd never be able to play dodonpachi without a dpad/arcade stick, for instance.

> What're the bugs? I played the game pretty frequently and didn't notice them.

Mainly in the save/loading game. didn't much like it fucking with my memory card, though I guess that may have been fixed in later pressings of it.

> The jaggies were OK, I could stand them. The fact that all new consoles used
> 480i instead of 240p (or whatever you want to call it) was annoying enough for
> my eyes so I learned to deal with that.
>

Yea, I know a lot of people that weren't really all that bummed about the jaggies *shrug* I dumped a fair amount of time into the game and was gradually able to get somewhat used to it (maybe because I was memorizing all of the courses so it didn't much matter if I couldn't really see the bend in the road; i knew it was there)

> I agree the gameplay of RR4 wasn't so great. I went back and played it recently
> though and it held up a lot better than I remember, but when it came out I was
> very disappointed though. I don't know if I'd play it except just a spin to
> remember wtf it's like when I'm bored.
>

I found the game to be way too easy, the jogcon to be a throw-away gimmick, and the courses to be downright boring :(

The addition of the trails to the tail lights rocked, though. I did manage to have some fun playing it with my roommate back when it came out... we'd just practice jumping over each other and fucking off. actual races just weren't terribly interesting :(

> Feel the Magic looks hilarious, and I HATE dating sims. Oh yeah, this is CA,
> start the "rub the clit" jokes.
>

I haven't checked that one out yet and I'm debating on if it's something I want to pick up full price. I may wait for it to fall into the used bin.

> Games that were never designed in the first place for analog sticks (shooters)
> suffer when you try to play them with anything other than a dpad or a solid
> arcade stick, though. There it's all about the mad twitch action. I'd never be
> able to play dodonpachi without a dpad/arcade stick, for instance.

I dunno why it varies for me, I can't play Outrun 2 without the Analog, can't play Ridge Racer V without the D-pad.

> > What're the bugs? I played the game pretty frequently and didn't notice them.
>
> Mainly in the save/loading game. didn't much like it fucking with my memory
> card, though I guess that may have been fixed in later pressings of it.

Do you have the japanese version? I have the north american night-of-ps2-launch version.

> Yea, I know a lot of people that weren't really all that bummed about the
> jaggies *shrug* I dumped a fair amount of time into the game and was gradually
> able to get somewhat used to it (maybe because I was memorizing all of the
> courses so it didn't much matter if I couldn't really see the bend in the road;
> i knew it was there)

Pattern memorization games are cool.

> The addition of the trails to the tail lights rocked, though. I did manage to
> have some fun playing it with my roommate back when it came out... we'd just
> practice jumping over each other and fucking off. actual races just weren't
> terribly interesting :(

Heh, the only multiplayer fun I usually have is just ramming into each other and playing hit-your-car-tag. That should be in the next Burnout.

> I haven't checked that one out yet and I'm debating on if it's something I want
> to pick up full price. I may wait for it to fall into the used bin.

Yeah, for certain. That game will get cheap fast.