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SubjectRe: For y'all who have problems w/center shots Reply to this message
Posted bysellenoff
Posted on05/11/01 11:49 AM

Thanks for the info metallik-

In your opinion, can these things be fixed by Randy?

Also, what are your thoughts on ProPinball's flippers?


> > Increase the flipper speed to 0.11 and reduce flipper power to 2. The control
> > becomes just like the real deal. Someone posted this in
> Well, those settings help (they're a LOT better than the defaults) .. but it's
> still a far cry from the "real deal." I've spent hours tweaking with the
> flippers, and have come to the conclusion it's impossible to improve the
> accuracy much past how AFM is, due to VP's inability to handle fast flippers.
> Here's the problem in a nutshell: On a real machine, when the flipper is
> activated, the bat snaps to the up position almost immediately. You can't see
> the rotation around the base.. the movement is so fast. If the ball is feeding
> from the inlane at anything close to a normal speed, the player can flip early
> and send a good, strong shot directly up the playfield. If the ball is cradled
> and then immediately flipped, it's even possible to shoot apprx 5 degrees
> "backhand" of staight up (although usually not strong enough to make a ramp).
> The aiming area of the flipper should range from straight up the playfield, to
> about 60-70 degrees off-horizontal. Shots such as Dr Who's "collision," Monster
> Bash's swamp creature, MM's catapult, etc. have to be made as the ball is
> rolling off the tip.. these represent the low end of the range.
> The problem is, if you set the flippers in VP fast enough to make shots from the
> base accurate, it really screws things up. Shots from the middle of the bat
> have a strange tendancy to come off as ultra-backhands, and shots from the tip
> oftentimes are so fast, they "break" the virtual table by flying off ramps, etc.
> It appears VP doesn't take the weight of the ball into consideration... on a
> real machine, shots from the end of the bat don't come off at mach 5 because the
> furthur down the bat the ball is, the more power is needed just to propel it
> since it's furthur from the fulcrum. The bat still snaps to position, but the
> shot power is reduced. Even if this was fixed, the problem with VP being unable
> to accurately simulate a very snappy flipper still remains.. On a VP-only table,
> with little overhead, one can make faster flippers (up to a point), but with
> PinMame running, fast flippers more often than not equal wierd physics.
> The best setings I've found are apprx 0.135 speed (this starts to push things a
> bit), and a strength of 1.85 - 2.0. The best "feeling" flippers I've been able
> to make are the ones on AFM .. I think since they're smaller than most, they tax
> the engine less and therefore are more realistic. Angles are important also..
> currently the angle of the flipper at rest and in the up position need to be a
> few degres "higher" than normal to help up the middle.
> Hopefully, Randy will introduce a newer VP with a bit more robust flipper
> support, although I'm not sure how doable that will be.. VP+PinMame requires a
> lot of CPU.. and there's a lot of calculations that need to be done VERY quickly
> when a player flips the ball. It'd be great if more CPU could be devoted to the
> flippers though.. basically, it doesn't matter how nice the playfield art is, or
> how accurate the table was recreated, or what cool tricks one employed to
> simulate the playfield toys.. if the flippers suck, the game's no fun. Just
> like the real thing.

Entire Thread
Subject  Posted byPosted On
*For y'all who have problems w/center shots  VeggieH8R05/11/01 01:10 AM
.*Re: For y'all who have problems w/center shots  metallik05/11/01 08:46 AM
..*Possible Solution?  crazypablo10005/11/01 03:01 PM
...Re: For y'all who have problems w/center shots  sellenoff05/11/01 11:49 AM
...*Re: For y'all who have problems w/center shots  metallik05/12/01 01:14 PM
...*Re: For y'all who have problems w/center shots  deep205/11/01 12:00 PM
....*Re: For y'all who have problems w/center shots  VeggieH8R05/11/01 04:20 PM